Do you think Stine spoke to Zodiac?

Discussion of Zodiac Victim Paul Stine

Do you think Stine spoke to Zodiac?

Postby Boyo » Sun Jan 06, 2019 7:56 am

Listening to Chris Garcia’s podcast, Zodiac Speaking, and he suggests that Zodiac got a thrill from interacting with both the police, and then his victims, more and more so. Garcia was talking about the Berryessa attack and the fact he wore a mask and this allowed him to speak to his victims.

I couldn’t help but then immediately wonder about the Stine killing, and if Garcia’s theory is true (and I think he’s probably largely correct), then I can’t help but wonder what he and Stine spoke about. Did Stine know what was coming? Did Z tell him what he was going to do? Did they travel in silence? Horrible to think about really.

Moving on then to Kathy Johns, assuming this is Z too, well we kinda know by and large what Z was like as a passenger.
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Re: Do you think Stine spoke to Zodiac?

Postby Simplicity » Sun Jan 06, 2019 11:03 am

The way i see it,
The Zodiac lured Paul into a conversation under false pretenses.
Paul mistakenly took the bait and "confessed his sins" to the judge the jury and executioner.

I believe this is the theme of the Zodiac, He went looking for "wrong doers" to cast judgement apon.

My guess, Paul believed in a woman's right to Abortion, women's liberation or simply thought the Zodiac killer was a closet homosexual. Either way it was sloppy and impulsive even by Zodiacs standards.
Last edited by Simplicity on Sun Jan 06, 2019 10:58 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Do you think Stine spoke to Zodiac?

Postby joku » Sun Jan 06, 2019 3:51 pm

Probably not, in my opinion. Not more than giving a destination. If Stine tried to make conversation with him, it was probably quite short-lived. Mageau stated that Zodiac did not say a word, and the dialogue at Berryessa could be described as short at best (despite him having covered his face and all). Writing letters is quite different from interacting in person, and I don't think Zodiac was really the most relaxed chit chat type.
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Re: Do you think Stine spoke to Zodiac?

Postby Israelite Wolfman » Sun Jan 13, 2019 1:32 pm

They had a few minutes (IIRC some source claimed 8 minutes, the other 12) to share a ride together, it is likely that they've had a chit-chat along the way, probably to lure Stine into lowering his guard/suspicion of the stranger he just picked. I don't think zodiac was too calm before he got to the cab and asked Paul Stine to take him to Washington and Maple, he was probably stressed about this whole new situation that was 180 degrees different than his usual M.O. of surprising couples in a secluded areas. Must have had second thoughts about if he can pull it off before going brazen in the last minute.

I can see Paul asks him, shortly after starting to drive, if he's from San Francisco to break the ice, zodiac reply that he is but not from the destination he asked him to take him to, then ask Paul if he's also native to town, after Stine replied the next question by Paul would be "what brings you to Presidio Heights?", zodiac will lie that he has some social stuff to do there (party, etc.) while in fact he has a parked escape vehicle waiting for him near the Julius Kahn Park, after he had examined and studied the area for a while in advance before going to murder someone out there and securing his escape route with a snatch of the victim's clothing to prove them "pesky" reporters he is the killer of all prior victims as well. They will continue to chat, probably about family/marriage (Paul: "are you married?", zodiac: "no.. are you?", Paul: "Yeah, I have a baby daughter", zodiac: "good for you", Paul: "Sorry if it was out of place, thought that you were", zodiac: "don't worry, nah, it's alright.. am not 'the marriage type', I like my quiet", Paul: "I hear ya.."). Then uppon arriving to Washington and Maple, he will begin to change his tone, perhaps even expose his gun at Paul Stine, telling him that he want him to drive one more block down the hill to Washington and Cherry, when Paul parks zodiac will confess to him that this is not a robbery and will ask him "if he heard the news about the zodiac?", when Paul will be sweating in fear and replying, I can see zodiac looks at him and tell him that he is the zodiac, and then pull the trigger. The noise of the shot will draw the Robins teens to the window and the rest is history.
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Re: Do you think Stine spoke to Zodiac?

Postby shrapnel18 » Mon Jan 14, 2019 6:58 pm

No idea if Z and Stine spoke, but Hartnett had some conversation with Z. He described Z's voice as "young and having an accent, but not a Southern drawl." Leads me to believe Z wasn't born in the area, if Hartnett could detect a difference.
Maybe look for a suspect who grew up in the Midwest or East.
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Re: Do you think Stine spoke to Zodiac?

Postby Dag MacLugh » Mon Jan 14, 2019 7:48 pm

Does it matter? Really?
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