Re: Deer Lodge Question...
Posted: Sat Oct 25, 2014 12:39 pmI've also pondered this on several occasions. If the ranger's statement is correct Hartnell initially said that Z claimed to be an escaped convict out of Colorado. He then, later, says Montana - and his initial suggestion is "Feathers", which he then changes to a two word name, something like "Fern Lock", upon which Robertson corrects him and says "Lodge", seemingly already convinced that the place in question is Deer Lodge (even though he can't remember the "Deer" part).
Some points regarding this:
Going from Feathers to Fern (Lock) could indicate that the name given by Z did in fact start with an F. Fern Lock is a plausible name, as is Fern Lake (a fairly common name). The step from "Lock" to "Lodge" is an obvious one, whereas "Feathers" via "Fern" to "Deer" isn't obvious at all.
If we assume that Z was indeed referring to an actual prison the list of candidates shorten - but isn't it possible that he wasn't referring to a real prison at all? If he claimed to have escaped from "Fern Lake Prison, Colorado" or even less specifically to "a prison" in "Fern Lake, Colorado", who were BH and CS to question his claim (at gunpoint in an extremely stressful situation)? It's highly unlikely that a couple of college kids in California would have been familiar with the names of correctional facilities up in Colorado - and Z would have known this too, it's common sense.
Now, don't get me wrong, I'm sure there are plenty of good reasons to assume that Z was, in fact, referring to Deer Lodge (a real prison which was even somewhat famous, at least in Montana, at the time) - but on the other hand we have Colorado in the mix, and "Feathers" turned "Fern" which - regarded in isolation - doesn't seem to point to Deer Lodge at all. The fact is that Hartnell - heavily sedated at the time - only agrees to this name after it's suggested by Robertson. One may speculate as to whether he couldn't equally well have landed on "Elk River Prison" if Robertson had suggested this.
Lastly, back to the ranger: He says Colorado in no uncertain terms. Could HE be mistaken? Colorado = Montana. It's possible, I guess. But the most immediate explanation nevertheless seems to be that Hartnell did in fact say Colorado at first - and not Montana.
Just a thought - a possibility among dozens of others in this jungle of a case.
Some points regarding this:
Going from Feathers to Fern (Lock) could indicate that the name given by Z did in fact start with an F. Fern Lock is a plausible name, as is Fern Lake (a fairly common name). The step from "Lock" to "Lodge" is an obvious one, whereas "Feathers" via "Fern" to "Deer" isn't obvious at all.
If we assume that Z was indeed referring to an actual prison the list of candidates shorten - but isn't it possible that he wasn't referring to a real prison at all? If he claimed to have escaped from "Fern Lake Prison, Colorado" or even less specifically to "a prison" in "Fern Lake, Colorado", who were BH and CS to question his claim (at gunpoint in an extremely stressful situation)? It's highly unlikely that a couple of college kids in California would have been familiar with the names of correctional facilities up in Colorado - and Z would have known this too, it's common sense.
Now, don't get me wrong, I'm sure there are plenty of good reasons to assume that Z was, in fact, referring to Deer Lodge (a real prison which was even somewhat famous, at least in Montana, at the time) - but on the other hand we have Colorado in the mix, and "Feathers" turned "Fern" which - regarded in isolation - doesn't seem to point to Deer Lodge at all. The fact is that Hartnell - heavily sedated at the time - only agrees to this name after it's suggested by Robertson. One may speculate as to whether he couldn't equally well have landed on "Elk River Prison" if Robertson had suggested this.
Lastly, back to the ranger: He says Colorado in no uncertain terms. Could HE be mistaken? Colorado = Montana. It's possible, I guess. But the most immediate explanation nevertheless seems to be that Hartnell did in fact say Colorado at first - and not Montana.
Just a thought - a possibility among dozens of others in this jungle of a case.