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I don't think he was worried about the car being seen. No matter where he was that day, he parked somewhere--even in Bryan and Cecelia's case. SOMEONE could have seen his car parked there. How was he so sure some wouldn't have pulled in in the general area of where they were parked and remember a car? --Because he parked elsewhere at the time of the attack, imo. I think he simply assessed the situation and then parked it elsewhere. He wasn't concerned about "his" car (probably didn't even belong to him).

If you read about how he walked down around the girls, it's almost exactly like he did with Bryan and Cecelia.

Solar Pons said it best a while back about abnormal behavior. We had THREE men all dressed generally the same way, of the same general build, acting in a far from normal behavior, lurking and watching. And this on a nice day people are sunbathing.

The fact is, this man was seen by SOMEONE that day without his hood on. If even at a glance as they drove by. We know he didn't drive around with the hood on....so surely, he was seen that day.

I dont' vehemently disagree with any of that, Tahoe.

Still, there's a difference between risking being seen (which is pretty much inevitable) and hanging around and giving three people the chance to observe you over a relatively long period of time. To me this behavior only makes sense if he was considering attacking these people. And if he was, that would surprise me. The location is poor compared to the spot where Z struck. And the number of victims is clearly not ideal. His plan was to have one victim tie up the other one - to me it seems obvious that he was looking for a couple.

As for the car, you may very well be right - maybe he planned on ditching it and wasn't concerned with anybody seeing it.

Norse, I actually have wondered the same thing, if he was going to try and kill all 3 girls. Could you imagine the attention that would get? He would have loved the attention, and media blitz that would have come. If he had done that, he might even be more infamous than he already is. I think he finally decided that too much could go wrong, and it would be hard to handle 3 screaming girls running in every direction if something went wrong. He still took a chance though, assuming Z was the man seen by the girls, by hanging out and moving on to attack Cecilia & Bryan after being witnessed by the girls. He had done that before, on Lake Herman RD- James Owen claims he drove by(if you believe him)and 20 seconds later, he hears a shot. Zodiac took a chance because Owen may have seen his plate number, etc, yet Z still decided to attack

You know, Morf - maybe he did consider attacking the girls...I have presupposed here that he hung around, in plain sight, for three quarters of an hour. But he didn't - I have no idea where I got that from: according to the girls he stuck around for about twenty minutes - then he disappeared.

And there is definitely something Z-like about his arrival at the scene: the girls pull up at the parking lot - and this guy pulls up right behind them, overtakes them and parks right next to them. He appears suddenly, it would seem, and the impression I get is that he has been tailing the girls. He then sits in his car while they get out of theirs - apparently studying/reading something, but they get the impression he isn't really doing that..it all sounds very plausible, and it does sound Z-like, albeit vaguely so.

So, yes - I suppose he could have been standing there, smoking, debating with himself whether to don his hood and attack those girls.

Then again, the guy could have been perfectly harmless. Just some guy who wanted to stretch his legs and have a smoke - and who didn't mind the sight of three young ladies sunbathing. Possibly a little creepy, yes - but no more than that.

I'm not a behavioral expert but one thing that (I think) stands out about Z's approach(s) was concealment. That and possible misdirection but I'll get to that.

LHR. Attack at night, no street lights (I assume). Flashlight claimed as sight but either way may have also been used to dazzle.

BRS. Attack at night, some lighting, flashlight used and used to dazzle.

PH. Attack at night, street lights but attack carried out in cover (in the cab) and a point black kill shot.

This one.

LB. Attack at day. Head completely concealed. Remote location. Restraints and getting the Cecelia to tie Bryan up before he approached totally, I would suggest partly to avoid anything that would compromise his disguise.

The point is that he planned and it seems apparent that a good part of that planning involved remaining hidden, or at least not identifiable. I also suspect that he might have planned his locations based on his approaches. By planned them I mean I think he knew the locations, quite possibly having visited them prior to the attacks to assess them for approach, escape, victim availability. That's what doesn't seem to fit for the guy the girls seen being Z given the concealment approaches he employs.

Ok, Z's not invisible but to sit and be observed for 20mins or so by three witnesses and then go and kill just down the road a short while later doesn't make sense. I don't think he would be so reckless either as to not be pre-decided as to how many victims he was looking for (and could manage) that day so I don't see why he would be sitting watching 3 girls trying to assess the situation on the fly as it were.

He was not happy about being seen after PH and even less so that a composite was produced. That's why I wonder about the KJ incident. It seems plausible that he 'claimed' that because she was so adamant that it was him based on the composite. I think he was trying to sow confusion as to it's usefulness most likely hoping that someone would be caught for it. With the Fouke incident he also seems to want to sow confusion. Knowing that it would be most likely pointless denying it was him the police passed that night he goes the complete opposite and not only confirms but says they stopped for a little chat. More confusion.

He reacts to being seen and does it quite proactively. He even pre-empts it when he thought his car had been seen when he used the phone and the operator called back after BRS. He's always ready to cover his bases regarding being seen and really tries not to be.

So it just seems so out of character based on his methods and reactions that the person the 3 girls saw was him.

Just my thoughts on it as best I can organize them and to see if anyone thinks they make sense lol.

Makes perfect sense to me - it is precisely what I've been thinking myself regarding the LB guy. Z didn't want to be identified - he wouldn't have taken unnecessary risks in that respect, that's my feeling. And semi-spying (for lack of a better term) on some girls he didn't intend to attack would have been precisely such an unnecessary risk.

But then - what if he was actually considering attacking them? As Morf suggests, that would have been a sure headline crime - it would have boosted his notoriety immensely. And the latter was what mattered most to him - I'm pretty sure of that. There's always a combination of what looks like premeditation and what appears almost random with Z. Could he have been considering attacking those girls? Even though his plan was more likely to wait until closer to nightfall - and attack a different type of victim (a couple, which was his signature after all)? I wouldn't rule it out.

But all things said and done - if I had to put my money on one alternative, I'd say the LB guy wasn't Z. Which means that the LB sketch is worthless. But I'm far from certain.

i dont know what to think of owen..if i did my math right he would have been approx 1700feet from the crime scene (more than 1/4 mile) while driving (figure 60mph=88feet per second)..i do not know the terrain (is it hilly or flat) but me thinks it unlikely he heard a gun shot?..any thoughts

Norse wrote:But then - what if he was actually considering attacking them?

Assuming it actually was Z it's not beyond a possibility but why didn't he then? He changed his mind? sure, lets allow him that but that's my point, why then drive just down the road and attack someone. If he absolutely had to kill that day why further compound his recklessness doing it so close to being observed for an extended length of time?

If the attack had happened the next day I could find it more likely it could have been Z as it could be explained as checking out the area. I mean this guy left his car and went to where he could observe the girls sunbathing. At BRS Z was in a car, at night and left .. then returned and attacked. These girls had 20 mins to observe him in broad daylight and nothing but instead he goes down the road and gets all disguised up to attack a male and a female in his most prolonged attack, with a knife and with the victims tied up. I believe he knew what he wanted to do and I don't imagine that the location of the 3 girls would have even been considered as suitable. He knew this one would take time and require privacy. I just can't factor in him leaving his car and going for a little think in full view of three potential witnesses. That's the part that throws it for me. Not only does it not make sense but it's different from any of his previous behavior and even his behavior at the attack.

Just my feelings/thoughts on it.

Agreed, traveller - at the end of the day this is pretty much what I think too.

Z came prepared to LB - we know this. He had his costume and he had his clothesline. The latter to me is a clear indication that he was on the lookout for exactly the sort of victim(s) he ended up attacking. And I find it difficult to reconcile the latter with the behavior of the man observed by the three girls.

According to the girls, it sounds like this guy thought he was being sneaky. He was watching them from afar, behind some trees. As he walked down the embankment to where they were, he did so in the same manner he did to Bryan and Cecelia.

The girls mentioned when they would look up at him, he would turn away---as did the fisherman and his son. This person too, did not want to be seen.

The clothes are a give away to me. You have to imagine yourself on a nice sunny day at a lake. And we have three guys dressed in dark clothing--sweater type stuff...and as one of the girls mentioned....she "thought she saw a white belt around his back...", but it was possibly a white t-shirt.

A black sweater-shirt, black trousers and possibly a white belt hanging out the back?
http://www.zodiackiller.com/LBReport10.html

This guy was simply stalking the area, imo. You think he just got lucky with Bryan and Cecelia the first time around? Nah...