morf13 wrote:The police think Z only had a 6 minute window to kill. I think it's likely 3-4 minutes. That car(if it existed),without a doubt, had to be Zodiac's. Owen claims there were no people or bodies around the cars, inside or out. A 1/4 mile up the road, he claims he heard a shot, which is likely about 20 seconds later or so. Therefore, that car would have to be Zodiac's if the shooting started that soon. There was no time for the car to leave and another to pull in, get out and start shooting. And where were the two Victims & the driver of that car when Owen went by? No place to be seen, but 20 seconds later, Owen hears a shot, which means they were there at the crime scene. Some would argue that Zodiac had them out of the car already,and ordered them down behind the cars when Owen went by, and therefore Owen did not see them. While that's possible, it seems as if the kids would have made a run for it when Owen's car went by to get help,not to mention,the evidence seems to show that Faraday was shot immediately after sliding out of his passenger door(not shot outside as if standing outside already). That didnt happen. Others have said that, maybe Zodiac & the two Victims ducked down in their seats when Owen went by, or that the two victims were ducked down necking in their car when Owen went by, thats also possible, but unlikely. All of the other people that went by the scene saw the two victums in their car,never were they ducked down, and if Zodiac was ducked down, he would have had to have sprang out right after Owen went by, jumped out and tried to order the kids out,then firing his warning shot, all within 20 seconds. Sorry, but these are the only two real possibilities in my estimation, which is why Owen continues to be the most obvious suspect in my book.
The scenario could very well have played out like this:
*The hunters leave the scene
*Owen happens upon the scene
*Owen backs in, his Driver's door is far away from the Victims. He gets out and perhaps, Faraday feeling uneasy, starts his car or starts to back up. Owen,just outside of his own driver's door, to stop Dave from attempting to leave,fires a warning shot in the air, or into the back of Faraday's car.
*Owen walks around his own car, to the passenger side of Dave's car, and orders them out, maybe telling them "all I want is your money", or some other BS story. The two teens slide out thru the passenger side, and Dave is immediately shot, which sends Betty running, and then she is shot in the back. She falls on her side.
*Owen gets in his car,and since he was backed in, he is able to drive straight forward,not running over the bodies(its a very tight area there, and backing up would have been hard to do without running over the kids)and heads off towards his Humble Oil alibi job in Benicia, having no idea that Stella Borges is about to pass the crime scene
*Stella comes along a moment or two later, and immediately sees the two victims, and specifically sees Betty on her side(the same as what Z mentions that she was on her side). Stella races off for help, and Betty who expires, falls over face down, which is how she is found when police get back to the scene.
*Zodiac mailed letters immediately following most of his crimes, but why wait 8 months to claim Faraday & Jensen? I think it's likely that Zodiac, felt he was a suspect, or was on the list of suspects for the Lake Herman Rd murders, and waited until he felt the coast was clear to write a letter taking credit for the crime. Owen certainly was somewhat of a suspect, police took multiple statements from him, tested his guns(rifles), and according to Owen, they had him test drive his route that night. Sloppily, and carelessly, according to Owen, they never asked him for writing samples, or finger prints. When they realized that a handgun and NOTa rifle was used, they never came back to Owen asking for his handguns.
In Owen, you have a guy that is brand new to the area, ex-air force(wing walkers),and is at the crime scene during the small window of time when Z struck. How police didn't properly rule this guy out is beyone me.
Sorry to take this off topic a bit, but back to the topic of the bullets(and casings), I think the scenario above is the only one that explains that one shell casing so far from the others, that Z backed in and fired a shot in the air perhaps immediately after getting out of his car, and this completely is at odds with what Owen claims he saw, which once again, would make Owen a liar.
Only read the first paragraph of your post so far and simply had to comment on the sentence I highlighted before reading on through the rest of the post.
That is a question I asked regarding Owen's sighting, where was The Zodiac in the flesh? And more importantly, where were Dave and Betty?? Were they both threatened and made to duck down and not be visible through the windshield? Already out and made to crouch behind one of the two vehicles? What we can assume with some degree of certainty, assuming obviously that Owen's statement is accurate and truthful, is that at the time Owen passes, Z must have only just arrived there seconds before he passes because David isn't lying face down outside the rambler, nor is Betty led on the gravel parking area. So, they must be alive, but where? I mean if they were both still in David's Rambler and were told to duck down with Zodiac rushing to hide behind the vehicle, then I don't if it's just me, but i'd be starting the engine and throwing my vehicle out onto the road to cause a deliberate collision with Owen's as he is just pulling into sight. The only place that I can see where and how Z would be able to maintain control forcing them to hide by ducking is if he himself had got into the rear of the rambler and ducked while keeping the gun focused on them.
It seems rather convenient does Owen's account.
1. Two vehicles parked in the turn in area, recognised the one vehicle that just happens to be the victims but could not see the details of the other as it was parked at an angle.
2. Happens to drive past at the time when Zodiac has arrived on scene, but hasn't shot anyone yet which would be instantly obvious if body's were lying on the ground but no, he happens to drive past in between Zodiac arriving, and him carrying out his homicidal urges.
3. Zodiac was very lucky wasn't he, a minute later here, or two minutes earlier there and Owen would have driven past just after Z had shot and killed David & Betty which would be almost impossible to not notice David and/or Betty lying on the ground. This again is another coincidental stroke of luck in the crime timeline.
Morf in the first statement he gave which way around did his discrepancy go, did he say in the first statement the second car was parked parallel to the rambler only feet away, then in the second statement say there was several vehicles width distance between each, or was it the other way around and in the first statement he said the two vehicles were set apart at a fair distance from each other, then In second statement say they were far close? I'm just trying to think from his perspective and wondering why , what reaon could there be for him to change the distance between vehicle A & vehicle B. (I am going to, at least for the moment, assume he consciously changed the distance between victim & offending vehicles. Which way round did he give the vehciles distance firstly. What would he benefit from changing the distance so vastly either as mere witness or even possible suspect (Again, just for this one post, I am looking it at it from his having made this distance discrepancy purposely)
Posted: Wed Nov 20, 2013 2:56 pm