Zodiackillersite.com

the hood gives me the willies...i agree with all the critism and it is just constructive critism...on every third full moon I may question CB and the D/E as just that..homicides with no connection to Z..in my mind the most compelling evidence is that hood..i cant say enuff about yours and others research into TK..its good stuff for thought..its 2015.may be the bastard is dead or may be its another frick up by the fbi and there refusal to dna test TK..why the hell not..just makes no sense to me..if TK been forced into an enema he can be tested for DNA

snooter wrote:the hood gives me the willies...i agree with all the critism and it is just constructive critism...on every third full moon I may question CB and the D/E as just that..homicides with no connection to Z..in my mind the most compelling evidence is that hood..i cant say enuff about yours and others research into TK..its good stuff for thought..its 2015.may be the bastard is dead or may be its another frick up by the fbi and there refusal to dna test TK..why the hell not..just makes no sense to me..if TK been forced into an enema he can be tested for DNA

Thanks for the comments. Thanks to all those who have posted on TK be it constructive criticisms, questions, evidence or debate. I think it all helps the search for the truth. Big thanks to Darla Jones for her many posts of new information and evidence.

Yes the hood gives me chills too! It would be of no use for Unabomber crimes or hunting...

Several good people in city and county law enforcement like Paul Holes CCCSD and Larry Montgomery OCDA have tried to advance the case for ruling TK in or out for Zodiac (and/or EAR/ONS and/or Tylenol) only to encounter a red tape BS logjam at the federal level. Beyond frustrating! Right now I have an overall frustration with the case, lack of action by the feds, lack of new developments, lack of greater interest in TK, too many hoaxes and hucksters in the Z case, etc. Lately I have been spending more time on other pursuits. Good news is I got two non-crime articles accepted for publication, so I am spending more time as an article writer & screenwriter and less as an amateur crime researcher. And just enjoying life. I may have an announcement to make soon about putting the case on the back burner. We will see. Right now the only hope seems to be that the homicide investigators in the Bricca case (Ohio family murders in 1966 probably related to the 1966 Illinois murder of Valerie Percy and perhaps 1968 Michigan murders of Robison family by ZODIUS) have sent DNA recovered from the scene to the FBI. Following up on info and evidence I gave them about possible Ted K, Zodiac and/or EAR-ONS connections to Bricca, a Detective Captain called me and was very interested in my evidence. Aside from the FBI on Tylenol, that is the highest ranking person to ever call me on any case. And I have a strong feeling that after looking at my info, they then made some kind of physical connection between Bricca and one or more of the cases I presented them with - Domingos-Edwards, bates, Zodiac, percy, Robison, EAR/ONS. Because their interest level all of sudden shot up. They eventually publicly declared Zodiac a suspect in the Bricca case. It is great they send DNA to the FBI. But the problem is it is STILL not clear if they ever did a DNA draw from Ted, and there is not likely any reliable DNA from Zodiac. There is good DNA from EAR/ONS and there may be DNA from other cases. So a link from Bricca to Zodiac, EAR/ONS, Percy, Robison or another case could be the thing that breaks it all open. But I am not counting on it actually happening, unless they get DNA from Ted. There is also still some faint hope in the Tylenol and (thanks to Darla Jones) Judge Vance mail bomb cases.

Unfortunately I think a lot of people don't "feel" like Ted is Z, in part because they think Ted was motivated primarily by politics and environmentalism. He was not. He records his urge to kill came from alienation, sexual frustration and a failed bid for a sex change operation in 1966, as I detailed above. He records he will really kill the people he hates, and he states that he hates LOVE MAKING COUPLES & ROWDY COLLEGE STUDENTS. Can it get more Zodiac like than that? For others I think they want Z to be an unknown and the case to be solved in some dramatic way. Ted already being known and locked up is for most very anti-climatic.

Yes Snooter Ted is the only known serial killer, bomb designer, code creator who had a hand made hood in his cabin. To me incredible evidence that has not got enough attention. It frustrates me that a black flat top hood with vertical eye slits, all like the Zodiac hood, was found in Ted K's cabin, and yet most of the larger Z community does not seem to care. There is nothing else I can do, and it feels more and more like I am wasting my time on the Z case. Most people don't like Ted as Z. OK I accept it. I think it is wrong but all I can do is present the evidence. If most people ignore it, so be it. If it is not the dramatic solution people want, oh well. There is more to life and I am finding more success in other areas.

AK Wilks wrote:What do you see as Ted's motivation vs. Zodiac's motivation?

Let me first preface my response by complimenting you on the work you've done building a case for K as a leading poi; I'm very impressed by the attention to care, sheer body of work, and high general level of intelligence on this site. And snooter is right. The mask in nothing if not bone-chilling.

Please don't misunderstand me. I certainly am not advocating abandoning the notion of K as Z. Notwithstanding the healthy skepticism I have for K's being the Zodiac, he nonetheless ranks very high on my list of suspects, no lower than third. It cannot be denied and must not be ignored, however, that history is replete with such coincidences as found involving K and Z.

To take my previous example, I've read the case for De Vere's authorship of Shakespeare and concede the rife unexplained circumstance involved in the authorship question. But to read the extant writings of De Vere and to moreover compare them with Shakespeare, one can immediately lay open the patent absurdity of the claim, notwithstanding the indefatigable, contortionist attempts by De Vere apologists to reconcile the differences.

Perhaps the word motivation in my original post would better be served by the word psychology. Let me explain.

I view Z as a consummate and malevolent practical joker. He strikes me as the guy who finds pissing in the punch bowl uproariously funny while most are properly repulsed by the act. Based on the tone, content, and general character of his letters, I can envisage Z finding humor in, and even laughing about, his murderous exploits while reminiscing about them.

K's acts, by contrast, appear to stem from pure, unvarnished rancor of, well, fill in the blank - society, women, couples, or what have you. It is difficult, for me at least, to impute to K and to the same degree, satisfaction in the sick humor so prevalent, indeed effusive, in Z's personality.

And, yes, while I would admittedly be disappointed were it revealed that T was behind the Zodiac slayings, I can not dispel the doubt that while tangible evidence hints at K's involvement, psychological reflections, in the absence of a smoking gun (DNA, perhaps?) is ultimately exculpatory, at least for me. Count me as an agnostic at this point: not convinced, but open-minded to what you have to say.

Oh, and thank you for your effort on this site. Keep up the great work!

I'm also curious, Ak Wills, what Hartnell has to say about K's mask. He is, after all, the only person to have seen actually seen it! Do we know if he has opined on it?

I would also add to my doubts as to K's being Z, the description of the attacker by Mageau and Hartnell as "beefy." Not saying the problem is insurmountable but does raise difficulties for K proponents and begs an explanation the like of which I've not seen. The issue of bulky clothing may be tenable in Hartnell's case (though given Hartnell's apparent halcyon state of mind during the attack, dubiously so), but not in Mageau's.

regarding z's motivations versus unabomber's - i could see z being the immature version of what the unabomber became.

side question - since that guy has a ton of ted k's old stuff isn't there a decent chance to find dna on some of it?

masootz wrote:regarding z's motivations versus unabomber's - i could see z being the immature version of what the unabomber became.

But then you have the up close/distance killer dichotomy. Again, not a fatal objection but a shade of doubt. It seems every bit of confirmatory evidence is offset by something which points to exclusion. For all the merit of the case against K, there are some real problems as well.

Hartnell has not been shown the Kaczynski hoods unfortunately. And once the hoods were sold they lose all evidentiary value as far as DNA.

valleylife wrote:

masootz wrote:regarding z's motivations versus unabomber's - i could see z being the immature version of what the unabomber became.

But then you have the up close/distance killer dichotomy. Again, not a fatal objection but a shade of doubt. It seems every bit of confirmatory evidence is offset by something which points to exclusion. For all the merit of the case against K, there are some real problems as well.

Both good points. Naturally I agree more with masootz in that I think Z evolved. After coming so close to getting caught in SF, Z now turns to bomb threats, sniper threats, sending in bomb designs. Bombs and sniping are distance crimes, sending in mailed threats of sniping and bombing are even further distance crimes. To me it seems very possible Z was evolving into a bomber. And 4 years after the last confirmed Z letter we have the first Unabomber crime.

I deal with the up close and personal killing issue, the evolution of Z and a lot more at the link below.. Please check it out. if you still have specific questions, comments or criticism I am happy to answer them.

The best thread here to see ALL of the most compelling evidence for Ted as Z is right here: viewtopic.php?f=102&t=938

And the incredible matches on handwriting and shared words and phrase are here: viewtopic.php?f=102&t=250

Briefly:

COULD KACZYNSKI KILL UP CLOSE AND PERSONAL WITH A KNIFE, BLUNT OBJECT OR GUN?


One of the main objections some people will make to the evidence about Kaczynski being the killer of Valerie Percy, the Zodiac or the EAR/ONS - and I admit it is at first glance a reasonable objection - is that Ted was mainly known to kill with bombs, not up close and personal with a gun, blunt object or knife.

If at some point you talk to an FBI Agent, criminal psychologist or serial killer profiler, they will no doubt tell you that the majority of "distance killers", those who kill by bomb or poison, do not typically also commit "up close and personal" crimes with a gun, knife or blunt object.

First, even if studies of known cases show that majority did not also do personal crimes, there is a minority who did.

Racist Joseph Paul Franklin bombed buildings and did sniper shootings, but also killed women up close and personal. Kaczynski had a unique pathology - a specific hatred of technology, business leaders and politicians (which shows up in his Unabomber crimes from 1978 to 1996 and also may have played in a role in the selection of the Percy and Bricca homes as a target), but also the general rage expressed in 1966, in which he wanted to kill "college students" and women. So Kaczynski may well be in the minority of distance killers who also kill up close and personal.

Second, there is evidence Kaczynski actually thought about and even did kill up close and personal.

The FBI states he actually did shoot and wound a miner with a rifle. In his journal that recorded in detail all of his bombing crimes, he also wrote of unspecified other crimes whose evidence he had destroyed and accounts of had burned or buried, because their revelation (in light of his growing reputation as a political terrorist and anti-technology activist) could prove "dangerous, embarassing or just very bad public relations." Certainly the brutal murder of a young college girl like Valerie Percy or the lovers lane killings of young couples by the Zodiac would not be something he would want publicly known, when some on the fringes of the radical environmental and anarchist movements now touted him as a hero of sorts.

He recorded a desire to kill people by "bomb or other means". He wrote fantasies about mutilating a women's face with a knife and raping a woman in front of her husband. He spent a year and made a one shot .22 pistol from wood and junk parts that he wrote he intended to use as a "homicide weapon". As a one shot untraceable weapon, it would best be used in situations were the victim was immobile, such as being bound or asleep.



He created a shoe device to leave false sole prints of sizes other than his own. That would not help for the known Unabomber crimes, but would for up close and personal crimes. The FBI records he had black and green canvas and denim HOODS and MASKS in his cabin - again, only suitable for personal crimes, and both the Zodiac and the EAR/ONS wore hoods and masks. He was a known peeper on love making couples, armed burglar, house trasher and arsonist.

One item I find interesting was that in reading about the EAR/ONS case it was mentioned that his shoe size was thought to be in the 9 to 9 1/2 area, and that matches Kaczynski. But I also read about some smaller shoe prints - an 8 or 8 1/2 - found at one or more scenes. If true that is interesting in light of something found in the Kaczynski cabin. He created a shoe with a smaller size sole attached to the bottom.

Apparently it was invented as a rather clever way to fool police about his own size 9 to 10 shoes, by putting a smaller shoe underneath. See it below.

The strange thing is he did most of his KNOWN crimes by mail, or a few by placing bombs in parking lots or on cement. So why did he create this shoe device? He also had maps of the LA area, yet he was never KNOWN to have done a crime there. Both the shoe device and the LA maps are generally inconsistent or not relevant to his Unabomber crimes, but may match the Zodiac and EAR/ONS crimes.

valleylife wrote:

AK Wilks wrote:What do you see as Ted's motivation vs. Zodiac's motivation?

Let me first preface my response by complimenting you on the work you've done building a case for K as a leading poi; I'm very impressed by the attention to care, sheer body of work, and high general level of intelligence on this site. And snooter is right. The mask in nothing if not bone-chilling.

Please don't misunderstand me. I certainly am not advocating abandoning the notion of K as Z. Notwithstanding the healthy skepticism I have for K's being the Zodiac, he nonetheless ranks very high on my list of suspects, no lower than third. It cannot be denied and must not be ignored, however, that history is replete with such coincidences as found involving K and Z.

To take my previous example, I've read the case for De Vere's authorship of Shakespeare and concede the rife unexplained circumstance involved in the authorship question. But to read the extant writings of De Vere and to moreover compare them with Shakespeare, one can immediately lay open the patent absurdity of the claim, notwithstanding the indefatigable, contortionist attempts by De Vere apologists to reconcile the differences.

Perhaps the word motivation in my original post would better be served by the word psychology. Let me explain.

I view Z as a consummate and malevolent practical joker. He strikes me as the guy who finds pissing in the punch bowl uproariously funny while most are properly repulsed by the act. Based on the tone, content, and general character of his letters, I can envisage Z finding humor in, and even laughing about, his murderous exploits while reminiscing about them.

K's acts, by contrast, appear to stem from pure, unvarnished rancor of, well, fill in the blank - society, women, couples, or what have you. It is difficult, for me at least, to impute to K and to the same degree, satisfaction in the sick humor so prevalent, indeed effusive, in Z's personality.

And, yes, while I would admittedly be disappointed were it revealed that T was behind the Zodiac slayings, I can not dispel the doubt that while tangible evidence hints at K's involvement, psychological reflections, in the absence of a smoking gun (DNA, perhaps?) is ultimately exculpatory, at least for me. Count me as an agnostic at this point: not convinced, but open-minded to what you have to say.

Oh, and thank you for your effort on this site. Keep up the great work!

AK WILKS: Thank you. Good question. I think as Zodiac, Ted's rage was more diffuse as he had not yet settled on technology as the ultimate evil. So as Zodiac he was killing for the sake of killing and playing a game with police and media. In 19666 Ted said he wanted to kill lovemaking couples, promiscuous women and college students. In Zodiac eyes that is who he was killing starting probably in October 1966 and definitely in 1968. As Zodiac his prankish and sarcastic nature came out more readily. As he said in his 1966 entry he was now ready to kill and do things that were "criminal and daring." But as the "Freedom Club", aka "FC", aka the Unabomber, he was posing as a terrorist group, which are not exactly known for their side splitting laughs and good humor. Most of the Unabomber communications are fairly dry and academic in tone. He was now trying to get across what he felt were serious points about society and technology.

There are a few exceptions - the Unabomber admitted that a July 4th threat to blow up a plane was a "prank" and said "we haven't tried to blow up an airliner (lately)." A rather sly sense of humor - and it matches what Zodiac said when he revealed a threat to mass transit (school bus) was a prank - "if you think I am going to take out a bus the way I said I was you cops deserve to have holes in your head." {Quote from memory}.

Zodiac said "2 cops pulled a goof"; Ted said "The FBI is a joke".

As a kid he hung a dead cat in the locker of a girl he liked. He also wrote a funny article that appeared in either Harpers or Atlantic magazine.

TK wrote dirty limericks and obscene poems against a woman who turned him down for a date.

TK also was a master at adopting different tones in different letters.

As the Unabomber he could be academic and pedantic.

But he also wrote a letter posing as a Utah resident pissed off at local lawyers "I heard you were a scoundrel! A super asshole! I give such people the BOMB treatment..."

As a teen he had an article published in a magazine about making a bomb, and it was funny!

And I think he adopted many other tones in different letters - young, scared, old, right wing, Christian, etc.

The only trouble he ever got into as a prof at U CAL Berkeley was when he wrote a letter pretending to be another faculty member, a ruse to get that person in trouble.

These are the Ellen poems and letter. Like Zodiac, Ted could be funny, sarcastic and cutting. Like the Riverside writer, he could do a poem.

Ellen poems and letter. Uses Zodiac terms "fat ass" and "nasty":

Have to admit the Deer Lodge reference is hard to explain to say the least if the place is as obscure as you say. Have a few more questions.

- Slover, Hartnell, and Slaight all heard the Zodiac's voice, claimed it was quite distinctive and would have no problem identifying the voice if they heard it again. At least in Hartnell's case there would be no reason for the Zodiac to disguise his voice. Have any one of the three opined on the similarity of Tk's voice to the Zodiac's?

- Have any of the four LB witnesses who provided the description for the sketch artists identified the possibility of TK being the man they saw on the day of the attack?

- Has Hartnell opined on the similarity of the hood found at TK's cabin to the one worn by his assailant?

Lot of pieces support TK as Zodiac, others don't. Could be a match for Mageau's description, 4 witnesses at LB, and PH; doesn't sound much like the man described by Hartnell, and he got the one undeniable and closest look at LB. Wish we knew more about Ross Sullivan, be nice to know more details about his mental health history. Most troubling to me is the distinct and very real possibility that the Zodiac has never been singled out as a poi or suspect.